North Star Leaders Podcast

Lindsay Pedersen

The world needs what only your business can bring. And as a leader, it's your job to deliver. But where do you focus?

Where do you direct your time, your team, your budget, and your emotional energy? We're learning this together on the North Star Leaders Podcast. In this podcast, I talk to purpose-driven leaders about the choices that they make to create audacious economic value while also realizing their distinctive purpose.

I'm Lindsay Pedersen, brand strategist, author of Forging an Ironclad Brand, and host of the North Star Leaders Podcast. Let's get to it. Today, it is my pleasure to have with us Lynn Baranowski.

Lynn is CEO of Avalyn Pharma, a respiratory therapeutics-focused company, and she has spent her career in an array of roles in biotech, pharma, and venture capital. Lynn, welcome to the show.

Lyn Baranowski

Thank you so much. It's just such a delight to be here, Lindsay.

Lindsay Pedersen

So good to see you. Okay, Lynn, to start us off, what is your favorite thing about what you do?

Lyn Baranowski

I love that I get to wake up every day and think about how to make the world a little bit better. So for me and our company, it's all about patients that we're trying to serve. In our case, we're working on lung diseases and drugs that will help patients that have a disease called pulmonary fibrosis, which is a very sad, deadly disease, and patients really need new therapies.

And I think what I love so much about my job is I get to sort of focus on that, focus on building a company, building a team that's going to build products that are hopefully going to save lives. And that feels to me very personal, and it definitely gives me the energy I need every day to wake up and get going.

Lindsay Pedersen

Yeah, you get to relieve suffering.

Lyn Baranowski

Yeah, mission-driven. It's definitely a mission-driven field.

Lindsay Pedersen

What did draw you to the role at Avalyn to become the CEO of Avalyn?

Lyn Baranowski

So I spent my career, as you said, in this industry, so biotech and pharma. When I got into the industry, which was 25 or so years ago, it was very intentional. Like, I was actually in business school, and I was thinking about what I wanted to do next in my career and I remember so clearly I had a list of criteria that I was sort of thinking about in terms of sorting out what industry I wanted to work in.

So I'll just go through them because they're still fresh for me. One is mission-driven. You know, I really felt myself like I wanted to work for a company and in an industry that was doing something meaningful to improve the world.

So I wasn't interested, for example, in like Jell-O. You know, that's just important. Number two, I'm someone that had, before business school, worked internationally.

I speak a bunch of languages. So I really cared about finding an industry that was very international. Third is I wanted to find an industry where the people that I would be working with were good people, like good humans.

And not every industry is that way. You get a lot of jerks. But that was important to me.

And then the final one is that, I think in my previous roles, I'd gotten bored, you know, before business school, and I wanted to find an industry that would be complex and complicated and keep me learning throughout the course of my career. So kind of a difficult industry. And when it occurred to me that biotech and pharma kind of met all those criteria, it was almost like a light bulb went off.

And so after business school, I started working over at Novartis in Switzerland, and that just sort of launched me into what's now followed. And so over the course of years, I guess I just progressively within that universe of biotech and pharma, tried to figure out for myself what the right role was within that universe. There's a lot of different roles and a lot of different size companies.

For me, I've migrated towards these smaller companies. And I think largely because it feels like in these entrepreneurial environments, you can have just so much impact in terms of building a team, building what we call a pipeline, and realizing that kind of mission and vision that I talked about. So over the years, I just kind of migrated more to these environments.

And here I am.

Lindsay Pedersen

Yeah, you are very much a North Star leader, which on this podcast, we define that as someone who's trying to do both do well and do good. Talk to me about navigating that tension between building the economic value and also realizing that mission that you described. What helps with that dance?

Lyn Baranowski

It's a very complicated dance. So in my case, I think again, I'm lucky because this industry is one where you can put patients at the center of your focus. And I guess I fundamentally believe that if we're making decisions in the company that really are about how do we impact patients most effectively, that's actually how we create the most value economically.

But it's not to say that we can ignore the value. Having a good understanding of the value, being able to tell that story is critical. But to me, it's almost two component pieces.

There's sort of the patient focus part, which drives, I think, everything, but you have to marry with it the economic realities of your business. So it's being able to think through the whole piece holistically, but having the patient part really drive the mission and the plans.

Lindsay Pedersen

Yeah. Tell my listeners about your no assholes policy within Avalyn.

Lyn Baranowski

This is hilarious. So, you know, again, I've worked in a lot of companies over the many years, and I think early on in my career, I didn't understand that it was possible to work with no assholes. And so I've had lots of colleagues, many of whom I love, and some of whom I, you know, maybe didn't love as much.

And let's leave it at that. But I think in my last company before this one, I happened to find myself working with someone who was the CEO in that company. And he and I just got along so well, and we just really connected as humans.

And we intentionally decided to build a company there that was filled with other just nice, good humans, good people, people you want to work with. And we did that. And it was definitely the best working experience for me until now.

So in this company, which is my first CEO role, I really wanted to take that forward and do it this time, clearly and intentionally. So as I started to build the team that we have in place now here at Avalyn, I said to my new colleagues that I was bringing in, you know, let's have a no asshole policy, right? Like, let's all look each other in the face and agree that we just want to hire people that we want to work with.

And it's not because we're all such optimists, it's more because actually, I think there's value in that. And it's this, it's that if you work with other people that you enjoy working with, and you can debate issues and have a great discussion, and brainstorm and challenge each other, you get to a much better place. And I wake up in the morning every day in this company, and I have a hard job, and it's intense.

But I genuinely look forward to meeting with and speaking with and working with the people that I get to work with. And that makes this all feel then so much more fulfilling, because I'm building a company for patients that's going to meet their needs. But I'm also building a company that's a lot of fun to work in.

And day to day, we just enjoy each other. So it drives the business need, I guess, if that makes sense. So I said to my colleague, let's have this no asshole policy.

They said ‘’yeah, but I thought it was all just kind of internal’’. But fast forward, you know, a year or so, I got a phone call from someone who was interested in our company and wanted to be on our board. And he and I talked and I said to him, you know, I'm curious, like, what led you to reach out to me?

And he said ‘’well, you know, I think you're really doing great work. And the mission is amazing. And you know, support your strategy. But I also love that you had this no asshole policy.’’ So I had no idea that actually, a couple of my board members had told him that.

So I don't know, I love it, right? Like, it just feels very authentic to me. But it also feels, as I said, it feels like it's important, actually, to driving what we're trying to do in terms of the culture, because we really get to a bunch better place every day than I could ever get by myself, you know, if I was just in a box and not actually collaborating and working together.

Lindsay Pedersen

Well, you got data from the universe that it's a competitive advantage to have this policy, most directly in that case with recruiting. But I also hear you saying that, kind of like what we were talking about earlier, navigating that tension between doing well, and doing good, the no assholes policy actually is a tool for navigating that tension. Which is so interesting. And there's something a tiny bit counterintuitive about it, like, in some worlds, assholes actually will, I don't know if this is true, but I imagine there are worlds where it would harm your bottom line to have a no assholes policy.

There are situations like that, I can name industries where that might be more common, but you're in one where that doesn't. And you've also developed an ecosystem that makes it your competitive advantage. It kind of unleashes people's best engagement and attracts the people that you want to attract.

Lyn Baranowski

Yeah, that's right. It feels like it's the right fit for me as a human, right? And it allows me to build this culture of people and team that I mean, I don't think we have a single asshole in our company.

Like it's just a great group of humans. You know, I'm sure that maybe there are situations where that's not the case, and people find other business models that work equally well. But for me, this just seems to be, you know, both fun and also the way to drive success.

Lindsay Pedersen

It feels also very long term success oriented, as opposed to like, this week's success oriented that in the short term, you might be able to, I don't know, something good might happen to your bottom line immediately without this policy. But in the long term, it sort of creates a protective flourishing that wouldn't otherwise be there.

Lyn Baranowski

Yeah, I think that's right. I think that's right. And hopefully we'll be able to retain people, right? Because people actually enjoy working here and working together. So retention matters a lot in my industry, and hopefully that will come to play as well.

Lindsay Pedersen

Attrition is expensive, and disengagement is expensive, especially when you're tackling such a complex problem. It's like, this requires people to bring all of their heart and mind into their work. I know that you've been an executive in a lot of function across biotech and pharma.

So you've been a COO, you've been in corporate development, you've been in commercial development, marketing, public affairs. What is uniquely hard about being the CEO, the person the buck stops at? And also, what's uniquely rewarding about that?

Lyn Baranowski

I mean, I think for me, what's hardest is probably that the problem solving never stops. It sort of feels like at the end of the day, maybe this is just part of being a growth-minded human. Growth is constant and continuous.

And no matter how good we're doing on any one day, there's always better we can do. There's always issues and problems that come up. So I feel like my job is primarily about spotting those, being clear-minded, spotting them, and then figuring out how to solve them.

And so that way of thinking, it's kind of a way of addressing the company needs, feels continuous.

So as soon as you solve one, there's a better one. It's sort of whack-a-mole a little bit.

So I would say that's uniquely challenging in this role. Not something I'd experienced before in the same way. But what is the most rewarding for me is, as I said, is sort of building a great team, watching people come together and do more together than we can do alone as independent professionals, and taking the products that we have and moving them forward and getting them closer to patients.

So there's a lot of fun. I mean, this is a really challenging job, but it's also incredibly fun. I feel like for me, in this role, this is really the first time that I think I'm experiencing the full scope of my experience and my abilities, where I think previously in other roles, I had never really quite stretched my wings in the same way that I am here.

Lindsay Pedersen

Right. Like it taps part of you, but not all of you. It brings out something that you uniquely bring to bear, but not as fully as being the ultimate leader, the CEO.

Lyn Baranowski

And this is, I am fully present every single day in every part of me. So that can be exhausting, and it's challenging and it's nonstop, but it's also so rewarding and fulfilling too.

Lindsay Pedersen

Well, that leads to something I wanted to talk to you about. And you and I've talked separately about the importance of filling your bucket with a lot of intentionality, especially when you give so much to your work. How do you do this?

What are the things that you have found helpful in building yourself back up when you're depleted?

Lyn Baranowski

Yeah, it's taken me a long time to figure this out. And maybe I have to kind of do a bit of a rewind for you just kind of how I came to this. So I had been living in New York city for 18 years and for many of those years loved it, but somehow over the course of time, and I don't know if it's that I've gotten older or if it's just that my jobs have gotten more intense, but over the course of time that started to feel like an environment that was just too intense constantly.

And I think the intensity of the job for me, I needed to find a way to balance that out with some non-intensity. And so what I realized I needed was just more actual physical space and natural environment. So kind of outdoors.

So to answer your question, I'm living now outside of Boston and I'm in a place that's surrounded by green and water. And that feels to me, it really rebalances me energetically. So often at the end of the day, I'll go outside that there's a koi pond in the backyard and I'll just like, after work is done, I'll feed the koi and spend 10, 15 minutes just sort of, it's almost mindful meditation, right? I’m trying not to think about work. I'm trying just to breathe and be in this external environment.

And somehow that natural world for me really replenishes my batteries.

In the summertime, I try to swim. That's another way for me that I, I really find a lot of energy in doing that. So I would say for me, it's those things, but I would say everyone else is going to be different.

So the advice I would have on that would just be like, encourage folks to tune in to whatever it is that they're feeling. And for me, it was, I'd been feeling this intensity that I was feeling in my body physically when I was living in New York and I needed the counterbalance. So that's how I've solved that problem for myself, that that solution is going to be different for everyone, I'd say.

Lindsay Pedersen

Well, I love what you're saying about how the power of that in some ways is almost less in the solution that you found and more in bringing awareness that you needed the solution. Oh, that's beautiful.

So the trick isn't universally to surround yourself with nature. The trick is to notice what are the things that deplete you, what are the things that fill you up, and to actually honor that, like not just notice it, but to like, it matters. Give yourself permission.

I heard a lot of permission in what you just said, like permission to notice. And maybe the thing that fills up one of our listeners is something that's counterintuitive to somebody else that's depleting. And that's cool too.

Lyn Baranowski

Yeah. And you know what? The other thing I would say about this is like experiment.

So before I moved here, I actually rented an Airbnb in this area just to try it out for a month and kind of see like, is this really going to feel like it's going to fix that thing I'm feeling? And it did, right. But I didn't need to move.

I just needed to try it and give myself permission, like you said, to experiment a little bit and see if it was a solution to a problem.

Lindsay Pedersen

So cool. Yeah. You can be playful about this.

You could just try things and not be attached to what happens and just consider it data. Whatever you learn is just data.

Lyn Baranowski

Yeah. This reminds me, this is totally off topic, but I'm just going to go ahead with it.

At one point in years ago, I was trying to make a decision about a career move. And a colleague of mine said at the time, why don't you pretend that you make decision A and like sit with it for 24 hours or 48 hours, see how that feels in your body.

And if it feels good, that may be the right decision. If it doesn't feel good, why don't you say, okay, now I'm going to pretend to make decision B and let that marinate in your body and see how that feels for 24 or 48 hours. That is probably a great barometer as you try to make these difficult decisions.

And I thought that was a great tactic. I've used that now multiple times.

Lindsay Pedersen

I absolutely love that. I think that for so many reasons, there's so much information we get from our gut and that we can... Did you know, this is speaking of off topic, there are so many neurons in our gut that it's the equivalent of a cat's brain.

So we have so much that we can learn that we might not be conscious of. I guess that's what makes it gut. And by sort of like somatically putting yourself in the space of having made one decision versus another, you can bring all of that intelligence to bear. I love that. I'm going to take that. And I even love the like 24-hour horizon because it's long enough to sort of get past like the initial like, it's like there's something powerful about that timing as well. What a good hack.

Lyn Baranowski

Let how it feels be the barometer. Like, I love that. And it works, right? So yeah, try it.

Lindsay Pedersen

Try it, everybody. Okay. Love this. My last question is, you can take this wherever you want.

What are you most excited about right now?

Lyn Baranowski

A good question. In life or in work?

Lindsay Pedersen

You get to decide.

Lyn Baranowski

Let's see. Good question. Well, I'll go to life first because it's maybe not what you're asking, but it's maybe more fun.

What am I excited about? You know, I feel like I've really intentionally in my life done a lot of work to make sure that I focus on building deep, rich relationships with the people that I love the most, you know, especially my friends and family as well. And, you know, I have a bunch of get togethers with some of my best friends coming up over the next couple of months.

So that gives me such energy and light. And I feel really lucky to have these incredible humans in my life. So that's the life piece.

Work wise, as I probably said, and hopefully communicated, I just am really excited about the work I'm doing and the company I'm building. And I think we have a really bright future and being able to wake up every morning and dive into trying to achieve this vision that we have and try to make a big difference for patients that are suffering from these terrible diseases feels really important.

Lindsay Pedersen

Beautiful. Thank you for sharing that, both of those. Okay, we have a few rapid-fire questions for you as we finish up.

These are like one word-ish answers to these questions. What is your favorite flavor of ice cream?

Lyn Baranowski

Chocolate chip.

Lindsay Pedersen

What is your favorite place to travel?

Lyn Baranowski

Oh, Lindsay, that's really hard. Grand Cayman.

Lindsay Pedersen

Oh, I have to ask you more about that later. Okay, what is the book that you've recommended the most?

Lyn Baranowski

Have I recommended a book the most?

Lindsay Pedersen

Or most recent?

Lyn Baranowski

Honestly, I don't read that much anymore. And it's a shame. I found that there's an inverse relationship for me in how intense my job is, and how much I want to read after work.

So I don't have mental space to pack more in because I need to quiet the mental energy down after work.

Lindsay Pedersen

I love that. You said it's a shame, but I think that it's another way that you're honoring where you are right now. I love that.

Lyn Baranowski

I love to read. And there have been times in my life where I'm reading voraciously. So it's just, I'm in a place now in my life where I don't have the capacity for it.

But I certainly will get back to it. Yeah, it's just not this season. If I have time, I mean, it's poetry.

So if I have time now that I'm sitting down, like on the couch, like there's a Margaret Atwood book probably open, but have I recommended that to anyone? I'm not sure. It's very personal for me.

Lindsay Pedersen

But it's for you. Margaret Atwood, poetry. Okay.

What time do you wake up in the morning?

Lyn Baranowski

About seven.

Lindsay Pedersen

And lastly, what is your favorite salty snack?

Lyn Baranowski

Pretzels.

Lindsay Pedersen

Awesome. Lynn, this has been so much fun. Such a delight to have you on my show.

Thank you for sharing so generously with my audience. Where should people go to learn more about you, to learn more about Avalyn?

Lyn Baranowski

Avalyn is at avalynpharma.com. So that's A-V-A-L-Y-N pharma.com. To learn more about me? I don't know. I'm not the kind of gal that has a website. So I don't know.

Lindsay Pedersen

Lynn has a LinkedIn page, and we will put that in the show notes because there are going to be people who are going to want to learn more. Thank you so much, Lynn.

Lyn Baranowski

Thanks for having me.

Lindsay Pedersen

Thanks for listening to this episode of North Star Leaders. Make sure you don't miss an episode by subscribing on your favorite podcast app. If you know of a North Star Leader whose insights would be valuable for this community, please message me on ironcladbrandstrategy.com.

Also on that website are show notes, transcripts, and a way to sign up for our monthly newsletter.

I hope you join us again for another episode of North Star Leaders.